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PostPosted: Mon Jan 29, 2018 7:04 pm 
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I have my current C1 since late last winter and it is my first car with air conditioning. The car was mostly off the road between October and December and I have now started using it again. Until this week I had forgotten to run the A/C once in a while to keep the seals lubricated.

Whilst I am aware that A/C sytems have a minimum outdoor air temperature range (9C ?) and we have been mostly getting temperatures below this, I have been pressing the button anyway in the hope of moving some oil around. I can hear the A/C clutch engaging and engine cooling fan running fine (except for a buzzing from the compressor at idle revs). Now what used to happen in warm weather was a kind of hissing / slurping noise which faded away within a minute or so and the airflow cooled down.

At the moment, I hear the slurping / hissing but that noise doesn't completely go away. It gets a bit quieter as the revs go up but the temperature at the air vents doesn't fall. The A/C pipes under the bonnet also remain at about ambient temperature and the engine feels as bogged down as it normally does with working A/C.

Does anyone elses A/C do this in winter when the temperature is below 9 degrees C?

(I have about 2 weeks of warranty left on the car and am therefore anxious to find out if the air conditioning has packed in ASAP).

(From the workshop manual, I see that the system uses a linear output pressostat, so I assume that the system would cut off altogether if the refrigerant pressure dropped too low).

Many thanks in advance for any thoughts,
R

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PostPosted: Thu Feb 01, 2018 11:13 am 
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there should be no hissing/slurping/burping sounds... these usually mean that the system has no A/C gas left inside - and as you can see the compressor turns but it can't cool the air. You might try a recharge, the machines used for that are able to check the system for leaks.

best,

DH


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 01, 2018 8:02 pm 
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Rasmus Lino wrote:
there should be no hissing/slurping/burping sounds... these usually mean that the system has no A/C gas left inside - and as you can see the compressor turns but it can't cool the air. You might try a recharge, the machines used for that are able to check the system for leaks.

best,

DH


Thank you. I am not sure I agree with the statement "there should be no hissing/slurping/burping sounds". From what I have read I am fairly convinced that they (citybugs) all make these noises - at least in the UK's cold climate but only do so briefly, at least on a summer's day. Ambient temperature makes a huge difference to the starting pressure of the R134a and must therefore affect the liquid / gas transition - see here for typical pressures https://www.vehicleairconservices.com/page/gauge_readings

The million dollar question that would really really help me right now would be discovering if this noise does go away when A/C is activated at low ambient temperature with somebody else's, -known good- car - let's say less than 8 degrees C outdoors. I am fairly convinced that the system won't actually chill at these ambient temperatures but in a healthy system, does the noise still go away after a few moments? . If anyone can help, it might save me a lot of money and hassle.

(The advice from the dealership wasn't very helpful and I can see myself being charged for a -potentially unnessary- regass with still the same symptoms. Additionally, I wouldn't trust them to consider ambient temperature when taking any readings - this dealership has really let me down in the past... I suppose the machines do recharge the system by weight of R134a delivered, however).

Please help me decide if this is a real fault before my warranty runs out! Compressors are stupid money!

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PostPosted: Thu Feb 01, 2018 8:57 pm 
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Location: Leicester
Drives: 14 Plate Peugeot 107
Can't say I've heard any hissing/slurping (or noises at all) with my a/c (which is working). Only had car since oct, and didn't know about not really supposed to use at less than 9 degrees (which means since I've had my 107 pretty much - not had many days above 8 degrees since then). I use it in short bursts daily to demist. No noises that I can hear.

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PostPosted: Thu Feb 01, 2018 9:07 pm 
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PirateTimelord wrote:
Can't say I've heard any hissing/slurping (or noises at all) with my a/c (which is working). Only had car since oct, and didn't know about not really supposed to use at less than 9 degrees (which means since I've had my 107 pretty much - not had many days above 8 degrees since then). I use it in short bursts daily to demist. No noises that I can hear.


Thank you. My 9 degrees reference comes from here viewtopic.php?f=6&t=6779 . I don't think it does any harm - surely it'd be in the handbook etc if so? Rather, I think that he meant it just won't chill if the ambient temp is lower. There are various references dotted about the internet of other cars' A/C systems not working below certain temperatures, 4C is another one with some GM vehicle or the other.

The noise mine makes is clear - a swirling hissing a bit like you can sometimes hear when the freezer's compressor switches off at home. It can be heard over the engine at lower revs. If yours is silent and you are definately noticing the air chill down significantly when it is on, then it looks like I do have a fault :(.

(Worst case, I'll either have the opportunity to go ahead with work amounting to a big bill or a £69.99 regass which may or may not hold in the longer term. Hopefully it will be a warrantable issue).

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PostPosted: Fri Feb 02, 2018 10:35 am 
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All l say is that every now and again in Winter l turn mine on much the same as you do.
Just to keep things ticking over. Last Summer l hardly used it, not sure even if it has gas in it, but the compressor does cut in. If the system broke l would not bother to repair it. Personally.


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 02, 2018 11:49 am 
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74hct04 wrote:
I am fairly convinced that the system won't actually chill at these ambient temperatures but in a healthy system, does the noise still go away after a few moments?


if the external temperature is too low, the compressor won't engage as you push the a/c button... you wouldn't hear any sound. If you hear the compressor kicking in, then a loud persistent hissing from the system, I'm afraid your system is empty. You might try to hook up a manometer to the valves on the pipes (should be schrader valves like the ones on tyres) and see if the pressure is good according to the charts you posted, but a full diagnosis is only possible with the proper diagnostic machine.

Personal experience on the aygo: I bought it used in the summer, a/c was working but weak, in the winter it started hissing and burping, and next summer it didn't blow cold anymore. Brought the car to a mechanic that hooked up the bosch machine, he stated that there was barely any pressure inside, due to a microleak somewhere that wasn't worth fixing. For 50 euros he offered me to flush the system, build vacuum inside, then put inside the right amount of gas, pressurize it and see what would happen... well, it worked again the whole summer long, now it's hissing again, and I'm afraid this summer I'll have to do the same again. To sum up, find an honest mechanic with the proper a/c machine and ask him.

best,

DH


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 03, 2018 10:53 pm 
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Rasmus Lino wrote:
74hct04 wrote:
I am fairly convinced that the system won't actually chill at these ambient temperatures but in a healthy system, does the noise still go away after a few moments?


if the external temperature is too low, the compressor won't engage as you push the a/c button... you wouldn't hear any sound. If you hear the compressor kicking in, then a loud persistent hissing from the system, I'm afraid your system is empty. You might try to hook up a manometer to the valves on the pipes (should be schrader valves like the ones on tyres) and see if the pressure is good according to the charts you posted, but a full diagnosis is only possible with the proper diagnostic machine.

Personal experience on the aygo: I bought it used in the summer, a/c was working but weak, in the winter it started hissing and burping, and next summer it didn't blow cold anymore. Brought the car to a mechanic that hooked up the bosch machine, he stated that there was barely any pressure inside, due to a microleak somewhere that wasn't worth fixing. For 50 euros he offered me to flush the system, build vacuum inside, then put inside the right amount of gas, pressurize it and see what would happen... well, it worked again the whole summer long, now it's hissing again, and I'm afraid this summer I'll have to do the same again. To sum up, find an honest mechanic with the proper a/c machine and ask him.

best,

DH


Thank you very much. I think I might be in the same situation as you then. The car is booked in for investigation on Friday. I am hoping that they can track down any leaks in the system with either a UV dye or "sniffer" tool but we shall see. If it's a microleak, I don't hold out much hope...

brixtonboy wrote:
All l say is that every now and again in Winter l turn mine on much the same as you do.
Just to keep things ticking over. Last Summer l hardly used it, not sure even if it has gas in it, but the compressor does cut in. If the system broke l would not bother to repair it. Personally.


I think that running it now and again in winter is a good move. I have been a bit of a perfectionist with this car - spent too much on it and now feel I need to justify that spending by keeping it in tip-top condition. (Yet, seemingly, all my DIY efforts go wrong first time!) :(

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PostPosted: Sun Feb 04, 2018 11:16 am 
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Drives: 2006 C1
I know how you feel. One of my head lights blow out a few days ago. Most of the roads here don’t have lights so it’s difficult to drive at night. Yesterday was crunch time, l hate this job on this car. The last time I simply couldn’t get the clips off. It was 0 degrees and l was getting so angry. Even my my GF’s son in law had problems. I got one back on, but the next one was just the bloody same. Late last night he managed to get the other one off and replace it. Soon l will rebuild it and hope that they work.
Today it’s snowing. On the bright side I was able to strip the N/S light, were l sealed it a couple of years back, has given up the ghost, so that is now redone. MAYBE


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 14, 2018 11:13 am 
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Drives: Aygo 2009
did you manage to fix your a/c?

by the way: I was thinking that I have to fix mine before summer comes. On sunday I will take the front bumper apart to check all the pipework, but I suspect that the leak is from the two schrader valves... I've heard some hissing while unscrewing their plastic cap. In this case, it would be a cheap and supereasy fix. Did any of you ever have an issue with these valves leaking?

thanks,

RL


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